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Join Date: Aug 2008
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Watch out for people like this!!! **Please Read!**
08-09-2010, 10:10 AM
People like this are everywhere in every field. As a freelancer, you'll find your fair share. Pass this link around while it's still up and be cautious of unscrupulous jobs that prey on your inexperience. And remember, ASK QUESTIONS. You're valuable and don't let anyone tell you otherwise!
EDIT: Should the above link not work, this is a copy of the blog entry:
Taken from http://kaitol.com/
"How to hire an artist
I’ve hired a bunch of people to do art for some of my largest games, I thought I would give a little insight on what do when hiring yourself.
How to find an artist:
I recommend looking through art sites such as Deviantart for an artist which suits your taste, or any other site that has a decent art community such as Newgrounds. There’s a few reasons you want to find an artist this way. First of all, they’re cheaper. These guys aren’t used to making a lot of money for their work so they will be more appreciative of the chance even if they are being payed slightly less than what professionals are payed. Second of all, they’re better. The quality of art you can find through this method is pretty amazing, and the vast amount of artists guarantee you will find something that suits your tastes and needs. Unless you have a specific price you want to pay in mind, ask THEM what they are willing to charge for the project. This usually causes people to give offers that are lower than what you normally pay, and will make them happy.
How NOT to find an artist:
Do not look for either professional artists, or an artist that has done a lot of game design work in the past. The problem with artists who do this as their full time job is that they’re usually expensive. Compared to what you can find through art sites, these guys tend to cost an arm and a leg. Artists who have done a lot of game design work are also bad for a similar reason, they know how much flash games can earn so they expect a decent percentage of the profit. It’s ridiculous to pay something 50% of a sponsorship when you can find someone else who would accept $500 for the same job. When your game sells for $10,000, the difference in cost is a multitude of 10.
Make it clear to whomever you hire that they will not be payed until ALL the work is completed, unless it is completed by a predefined date, and unless it matches or exceeds expectations. Sometimes I have an issues getting all of these things, but if you give someone a job they’re expected to treat it as so even if they’re just a hobbyist. Paying prior to the completion of the project is a bad idea for several reasons. Only paying for the finished work encourages the artist to finish their job faster, if you pay up front the artist has no motivation to finish quickly. Similarly, if you pay up front the artist could disappear and you may never get what you payed for!
Keep them in the dark:
This relates back to what I talked about earlier. If an artist knows how much their artwork will increase the value of the game they will then feel they deserve that amount of money. This is not how a market economy works, you hire whoever is able to do the best job for the lowest amount of money, anything else is a loss of money on your end.
Give strict dates about when you need the art done (even if you don’t) and give consequences by deduction in pay if the art is not completed by the date. Unless the person you’ve hired happens to be very punctual, you will need strong motivation to make sure they finish the art in a timely manner. Try to only hire people ages 18+ (I may sound a little hypocritical here), kids are generally less reliable and have more IRL things come up that they can’t control. I’ve had several bad experiences with this."
Last edited by DrEuphony; 08-09-2010 at 07:06 PM. Reason: clarification
Join Date: Jan 2010
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08-10-2010, 03:48 PM
Your last sentence is the catch though, he cant afford/wont pay professional prices from people that *know* how much their art is worth and any cheaper art he may have got on Deviantart from young/naive artists (who will hopefully be much more aware about this guy and his counterparts) that are willing to use the fact that amateur artists undervalue themselves and will consequently charge higher rates. (And as the price of art on DA is already very very low this can only be good)
I dunno if you have read this response to the article but I think it says why alot of people are annoyed with the article: http://www.thejonjones.com/2010/08/0...ire-an-artist/
Join Date: Dec 2009
Thanked 25 Times in 23 Posts
08-10-2010, 04:28 PM
Well, I have been doing videogame art for over 10 years now. I wouldn't charge the same if I was just starting and I *SHOULDN'T* charge the same if I was just starting. I have seen a lot of artists think that they can do whatever and when they start doing the job, they realise it's much harder/longer/more complicated that they thought.
There is a reason why experience is rewarded. This guy clearly has no problem working with people who are very green. While it might be seen as predatory, it's useful experience for the artist (much more than anything you find in the "non-paying jobs" section of any forum, because the guy makes games that make enough money that he can pay artists (and he quotes somewhere that he sometimes pays several hundred dollars, which is more than many many jobs I see on forums) and he can go out and hire MORE ARTISTS. So even if you despise him, he's still doing something right. With more game devs going bust after 1 or 2 games, even if he's a small player, I think he's o to something.
How I see it, artists quote a price and agree to his term, they get experience and they are happy. The only reason they get unhappy is that now they see that the guy thinks he's getting away for underpaying artists, but they wouldn't be unhappy if he had'nt opened his big mouth. He's also hiring people who probably never would get job offers like that because they have no experience. The thing is, people underestimated their quote because of their own lack of confidence/experience so they only have themselve to blame.
Have you ever gone to a garage, get a quote and think:"Wait, that's way too low, I should pay more for this" ?
Edit: I don't mean to say that his advises are good or recommend that anyone follow them. I just don't think he's the monster you are making him to be and I wish him well and hope this little media storm does some good to his business and teach him to shut the fuck up when he thinks he's getting away with murder.
Art & Industry blog http://qitsune.wordpress.com
Last edited by Qitsune; 08-10-2010 at 04:33 PM. Reason: added comments at the bottom.
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Join Date: Apr 2011
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04-13-2011, 06:36 PM
Oh man, maybe i don't want to be an artist after all if this is the mentality of the people i would be working for.
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