[SCWatson]

Originally Posted by DarioCoelho

Is there an exact time for the deadline? I'll probably have to work on my entry until the last minute, so everyone counts. So is midnight, the 24th the deadline? Or end of 25th? Which time zone counts? I'm currently in berlin.

Sorry if this is answered somewhere else and I missed it, but maybe I'm not the only one wondering...

Thank you!

Thanks for bringing that to my attention - I thought I had included that in the Finals Thread (it's there now).

5PM Pacific Standard Time, January 25th. So, if you're Berlin, that means ... what? 1AM Jan 26th for you - I think.

I usually allow for a bit of a grace period, or if someone knows they are going to be late, they can PM me ahead of time and I'll slip them in, but I try to keep the deadline fairly tight. That said, it obviously doesn't work out that way every time, but I try

Best,
~S

[SCWatson]

What is everyone's feeling about a Facebook fan page type dealy? Do you think something like that would make sense, or it is it a bit too soon for that? Or is it even necessary? What's your feeling?

Thanks,
~S

[arttorney]

I personally don't hang around in Facebook, but I understand it is a good way to attract interest from new people. Most of us wouldn't be drawing if we didn't want people to look. Therefore I don't see how it could hurt.

[SCWatson]

Originally Posted by Nickillus

re - I don't agree that there needs to be a financial incentive- all those topics on CA gather tons of attention without any such thing.

I guess I must be expressing myself really badly - and apologies for that.
I am definitely not advocating financial incentives. From experience the burn of a lot of artisit/illustrators is to see their work in print. I cite the example of submissions to the various Ballistic volumes of work, Spectrum annuals etc. I also cite ImagineFX challenges where success in various of the formats can result in inclusion in a subsequent issue of the physical magazine. Folk can get very excited about that. It's actually encouraging to experience.

My suggestion is based on the enthusiasm I've seen in other places where folk seem to want that experience. It will still only pander to those who have an illustrative bent - but would simply add another dimension to what I see is a very worthwhile challenge thread, with relevance to real world publishing constraints.

We're talking about a volume that only comes out once a year - if it's the money that is worrying people, I will buy that first copy (which I more than likely would anyhow), to set the thing up in the Blurb shop - and then there will be no expense to the organisers at all.

Why shouldn't this become a training ground for those with a yen to go into illustration?
Why should we not be capable of producing a printed product that people aspire to gain inclusion in (as with the Balliistic products etc)? They all had to start somewhere.

Yes there are hurdles to overcome - yes there are pitfalls to avoid - yes it might not be as straightforward and easy as I make it sound.

Where is the ambition guys? I'm already a full time pro and have been for nearly 30 years. There's nothing much for me to gain from this, and yet I still get excited by the possibilities of self publishing at minimal cost/risk. Am I missing something?

I've just come back from the degree show at the local art college where I teach occasionally. Both in the illustration and photojournalism course shows (to name but two) there were numerous quality Blurb produced books that would happily grace the shelves of bookstores and not look out of place.
The head of illustration, who is a good friend, got excellent response at the London Book Fair this year to their self published books. Pro art directors were directing clients to the College stand to check them out. I don't think it is me that is missing something here.

I'll withdraw now and hold my peace. Apologies if I sound rather impassioned. I value illustration as an art form and see great potential through this thread. Fight for it. Nurture it. Help it grow. It may well pay you back in ways you don't expect.

Hey Nickillus, no need to excuse yourself from the discussion. You've got some good ideas and I'm not opposed to them. And, please don't feel that I'm singling you out - because I'm not, really.

We (CGHub) and I had spoken about the possibility of a winners' book at some point down the road - essentially the same thing that you're talking about. So, in a lot of respects, you're right on track with that. But, there has to be the underlaying interest in the activity first before we can really do that - and that to means having a solid base of participants.

I established Chow - character of the week - over on ConceptArt.org years ago. It is by far one of the most popular weekly activities on any forum. So, for me, it's a pretty easy comparison to see what is working and what isn't.

Your view of view of what Story Tellers is supposed to be about is also spot on.

The primary issue as I see it is just general interest in the activity. My point bringing up Crimson Daggers was not so much that they're a structured activity, but that they have an active member base - same with Creature Planet(s), while we here just simply don't.

So, from my perspective, it comes down to these points:

1. How do we increase interest in the activity?
2. How do we maintain that interest?

Concerns that I have range from is the activity itself fundamentally too complex? I'm still not certain about the time range (1, 2, 3, or 4 week turnaround). And topic selections - obscure books/stories seems to gather more interest than popular ones?

Bottom line, the activity hasn't garnered enough interest on it's own to support itself.

I think a couple of weeks' hiatus while these, and other points are addressed is in order, and I encourage anyone who is interested in throwing out suggestions here.

[Nickillus]

All very well said, Oregano.

And I do thank you for the clarity of that full explanation of your standpoint - and take on board your well reasoned reservations.

I'll cross my fingers and other bits that other folk jump up and think this challenge is worth saving - and have ideas to go with that sentiment. As you say - if not, there really isn't much point as the interest obviously isn't there - dead horses and flogging spring to mind? And perhaps if anything an alternative approach may be in order? Maybe something not challenge based so much as project - with an end product - (although that's me getting way too far ahead of the topic so ignore, mostly)?

I wasn't about to bow out - just shut up so other folk weren't harangued out of the conversation by my outburst. Never felt singled out exactly. I mistakenly thought you'd misunderstood my intentions. That's what a few all nighters will do to your (my) judgment. No harm, no foul either way I hope.

Thanks also for moving this to an appropriate area for proper discussion. What a good mod you are.

[dman3d]

I love the topic but simply dont have the skill to participate reasonably. I ususally work on my own, sort of participating along on some as an exercise whether the topic is in progress or over (this and other challenges).
Had a ton of ideas for Conan but simply cannot make them (it).
I would imagine for the folks with the skills they may simply be too busy to work on some of these more demanding subjects?

[SCWatson]

Originally Posted by dman3d

I love the topic but simply dont have the skill to participate reasonably. I ususally work on my own, sort of participating along on some as an exercise whether the topic is in progress or over (this and other challenges).
Had a ton of ideas for Conan but simply cannot make them (it).
I would imagine for the folks with the skills they may simply be too busy to work on some of these more demanding subjects?

One of the main things about Story Tellers is that it's open to anyone of any skill level. So, that shouldn't hold you back - plus, the activity is designed to be a learning experience so you could get crits and comments on anything that you submit.

[BMitkov]

I'm usually overwhelmed with work, both at the office and home. "Conan" was my first participation, mostly because i truly love the theme, and this combined with the tragic dead of Frazetta, kept me working till the end of the challenge. Now, "Wheel of Time" is totally different subject - i haven't read the book /started it, but didn't fell in love, so to say/, and using just the Wikipedia is definitely not the way i love to work. This and my daily work was the main reasons to skip this one. However, to keep the interest in this activity i propose picking few themes and let the people vote for them - the one with the highest vote could be the next. Just my 2 cents.

PS. More time, like 2 weeks, might be also a good way to bring more people to participate.

[smugbug]

I'm in the same boat as Borilius - I participated in the Conan challenge as I both loved the theme and such a lifelong fan of Frazetta's work.

Luckily, I work part-time in a bookstore and was able to do a bit of research for "Wheel of Time" there and a couple of fellow employees who both read the books also provided me with some insight. But the subject matter isn't pushing my buttons like the previous challenge did.

But I love the STS challenges - great idea and alternative to the more conceptual challenges as it's a great showcase for illustrators!

[SCWatson]

Alex,

Thanks - that's actually some *really* good food back there. You've got my gears turning on how to revamp the activity ... I'll be thinking this through some.

Good points about Chow, though, and I really appreciate the time you took to post your thoughts. Thank you!

Best,
~Shane

[SCWatson]

Just wanted to give you a heads up that icon and naetronic will be heading up a reloaded and re-visioned Story Tellers as ILLUSTRATED, starting today.

I can tell you there is some exciting stuff coming your way, and I think you will all have a blast! Keep an eye out for a new round later today!

Best,
~Shane

[Nickillus]

That's fabulous news, thank you Shane. Excellent that the forum/thread is to continue and sounds like it's going to be even bettererererer. Good for you and the team.

And a big well done and welcome to Naetronic, our new overlord. All praise to the Tronic.